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The Twiglet Zone (Live from Skaro!)

by Twiglet

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I am a model. At the moment I am Marshal Ney from the Airfix Napoleonic Wars gift set..




We really do live in Skaro!

http://moblog.net/view/909507/skaro

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IS IT JUST ME...

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...Or are there others who are really sick of the sheer quantity of religious posts turning up on moblog?

I don't know if anything can be done about it but are all these posts with the Biblical readings which are currently dominating moblog getting on anybody else's nerves?

Shall I put a comment on the forum? I thought we were supposed to be attracting subscribers. I can't see that this is anything other than off putting.

I'm referring to VANDER's moblog by VANDERKOK for anyone who hasn't noticed.

(Photo from Torchwood mag. Not my work)

paintist says:

I have noticed! sometimes the whole page seems dominated by these posts....surely they are just another type of spam

21st Sep 2009, 17:36

Twiglet says:

Eight out of 12 posts on the front page!

21st Sep 2009, 17:36

paintist says:

yep :-(.....to the forum I think

21st Sep 2009, 17:38

Twiglet says:

I've left a message there. Are these movies or audio? They don't play for me...

21st Sep 2009, 17:44

Twiglet says:

Forgive my manners paintist, thank you for commenting.

21st Sep 2009, 17:46

paintist says:

I have just googled vanderKOK and he is swamping everything he can find with his message...you can watch his rather strange video on you tube...but its not worth it ...really...

21st Sep 2009, 17:48

Twiglet says:

I've PM'd nige as well. Short of getting you to press the abuse button to bring this post to the attention of all mods I suppose I've done all I can.

21st Sep 2009, 17:55

paintist says:

I thought of the abuse button... but then I didnt fancy a discussion about free speech and rights to religious opinion discussions...... sigh

21st Sep 2009, 17:58

Twiglet says:

I know what you mean. I'm an atheist though, we have few rights...

21st Sep 2009, 18:01

billion says:

you can't fault the dude's commitment to the whole god thing, but it's never any fun when someone swamps the "latest images" pool like this. I remember this happened before when a guy set his laptop camera up to instantly take a picture and upload to moblog whenever there was any movement in his room. the sheer volume of uploads does not a happy community make. communities should have equal voices; at the moment vanderkok seems to be drowning everyone else out.

21st Sep 2009, 18:05

Caine says:

I want him off the latest page, but others seem to feel that's not fair or right. I guess it isn't spam if it's religion.

21st Sep 2009, 18:07

Twiglet says:

Yes and these posts don't play for me so I can't even enjoy the committed message...

It's religious spam and should be removed like any other spam.

21st Sep 2009, 18:07

Spiderbaby says:

No, it isn't just you. And the links don't play for me either, for which I am grateful.

21st Sep 2009, 18:09

Twiglet says:

If the links don't play then what is the point?

21st Sep 2009, 18:11

Twiglet says:

I am seriously considering whether or not I want to stay with moblog and so is BS.

21st Sep 2009, 18:13

billion says:

isn't the point that there are just too many uploads?

21st Sep 2009, 18:13

Spiderbaby says:

I think it's some sort of divine justice ;)

All this does remind me to post more frequently however, post anything at all!

21st Sep 2009, 18:14

I can't stand this bollox.

It's not even like the guy will contribute to a debate he is just a cowardly muppet who is flooding a site to publicise what is probably his own idiosyncratic view of religion.


And I bet he is a bloody pressupositionalist. No bloody manners.

21st Sep 2009, 18:14

Twiglet says:

I don't know billion. I'm shocked by Caine's comment.

21st Sep 2009, 18:14

paintist says:

Spam, spam spam spam
I am making light of it, but it really really is ticking me off....

21st Sep 2009, 18:20

Craft says:

I am in agreement with Twig.

Lovely pic BTW x

21st Sep 2009, 18:20

jc1000000 says:

Twiglet, if it's of any interest it's been debated back and forth between the mods too.

Is it spam? Is it free speech? Is it ruining the user experience? Are we being judgmental?

Paintist is right tho - it's teh same content everywhere. I wouldnt be so bothered if it was not for the fact that most of the content doesnt make any sense, is almost gibberish and has misleading titles that dont relate to the content.

21st Sep 2009, 18:20

Spiderbaby says:

Oh dear the conversation is moving too fast for me, I meant it was lucky that the links don't work.
With any luck he'll be done soon and things can go back to a more normal level of politeness. Please don't leave! We need you!

21st Sep 2009, 18:20

billion says:

spiderbaby, "jesus on the cross" was one of his recent posts but if you've read the book you'll know that it doesn't end there...

21st Sep 2009, 18:23

paintist says:

I have just left comments on his posts, but have realised ( too late sorry ) that it has pushed other comments down the list....bl**** ****

21st Sep 2009, 18:24

Twiglet says:

Spider: Too fast for me too. No offence taken whatever it is you are referring to!

JC: I appreciate your answer. As you are agreeing with paintist that this is spam why isn't it being removed?

21st Sep 2009, 18:24

paintist says:

OK, this is one reason I like flickr...I can personally 'block this user" never see them again, never have them come up on my pages.......

21st Sep 2009, 18:28

jc1000000 says:

To be hoenst with you - we're not sure whether it is spam or not - we're sort of divided on the issue. (Or at least, i was)

To be perfectly honest, i didnt notice it as a problem at first - i must have been out when all the uploads hit the site.

But when you see this kind of thing



And then when you
>look at the Google results
it's obvious that this is a mass engagement, with no real attempt to play nice with the community.

I'm starting to think, as many have also commented in Mod discussions, if it looks like spam and smells like spam it probably is spam.

I think a quiet word in his lughole is ideal right now. And then if we get no response we have to consider deleting content (something which on the whole we are loathe to do).

21st Sep 2009, 18:29

billion says:

I think this is a great opportunity for the mods to get together and take decisive action, that type of which parabolichobo said was lacking when he left moblog.

21st Sep 2009, 18:30

jc1000000 says:

Billion - We're conference calling tonight - so i'll stick it top of the agenda. Thanks for chiming in because it helps us to know where we should and shouldn't act.

21st Sep 2009, 18:31

jc1000000 says:

Paintist - we've been looking at developing a button like that directly as a result of these recent spate of posts.

21st Sep 2009, 18:33

jc1000000 says:

AmericanFriend - "There needs to be a written definition of what is considered spam if it isn't money related, but propaganda instead."

We're getting there with a document... we should maybe put the final document up for review? It's very difficult to consider all eventualities and not ruin the user experience of the site.

21st Sep 2009, 18:36

Twiglet says:

Thanks for listening people.

The reason why I'm particularly pissed off this evening is because my niece Dazzle_Dust made a really exciting post which was instantly lost in all the religious stuff. It was on the front page for a matter of a couple of minutes only. : (

21st Sep 2009, 18:38

Caine says:

JC, I posted FundyGuy's google history on the modsgroup a week ago - I've consistently argued *for* taking the guy off the latest page. I quit participating in the discussion because most everyone else is like you and "doesn't see the problem."

I pointed out that there was at least one other very devout christian moblogger, who actually posts photos, many of which have been highlighted. When they have a 'message' it is quiet and low key. That sort of thing is fine, and not bothersome.

What's going on here is straight out fundamentalist proselytizing, and it damn well is spam as well as being offensive and past the pale annoying to a good many people.

It was pointed out that "ignore it and it will go away" wouldn't work. The latest page needs to be generally attractive in order to bring in new members. And, as always, alienating standing members is a very bad idea, eh?

21st Sep 2009, 18:43

Joe says:

Cain, you're being extremely unfair and misrepresenting the views of other people. Not one mod in the conversation that took place said that they "don't see the problem." Everybody saw the problem, everybody accepted that this makes the latest page very unattractive especially to new users. But we have an issue of fairness to consider, and any action we take will set a precedent which we must then apply to all other cases like this. I for one am not happy to start making sweeping judgemental decisions without first trying every other option open to us. I fully accept that this is spammy as hell, but we do need to ensure that we're not excluding anyone, just because we don't like what they're posting.

21st Sep 2009, 18:54

jc1000000 says:

Caine - point taken! I know it's after the fact, and maybe we had to learn the hard way, but doesnt mean that what you said then or now is any less valuable. It was then, and now, well, it's proven.

We just have to consider all eventualities and we cant accuse people of spamming in what may easily perceived to be a difference in belief.

And also - we still not totally agreed that this is spam. But what we can agree on, as you raised, is that it's damaging user experience when latest page is flooded by one user. And Twiglet has shown exactly how that happens (sorry Twiglet).


21st Sep 2009, 18:54

mat says:

I think you'll find this is trolling, if it's anything.

It's not spam. Spam is the advertising of commercial services. He's not doing that. (ok, you can make a case for churches being commercial operations, etc. etc. but I don't think it stands).

Semantics might be a bit of a fiddle to argue over, but in this case it's important. This notspam is why this guy hasn't broken any rules.

21st Sep 2009, 19:02

paintist says:

"Often, calling someone a troll makes assumptions about a writer's motives. Regardless of the circumstances, controversial posts may attract a particularly strong response from those unfamiliar with the robust dialogue found in some online, rather than physical, communities. Experienced participants in online forums know that the most effective way to discourage a troll is usually to ignore him or her, because responding tends to encourage trolls to continue disruptive posts — hence the often-seen warning: "Please do not feed the trolls".

so we are going to see moblog just dry up because we can't won't do anything about this.....

21st Sep 2009, 19:06

Twiglet says:

Thank you for contributing everyone. I felt sure I couldn't be the only one!

I had no intention to insult anyone's God or religion although we really are atheists and proud of it.

I was having a perfectly reasonable discussion with AmF about poetry when my niece posted some good news on her moblog. BS and a very good friend also a moblogger came in together shortly afterwards and I went to show them Dazzle's post and it was gone.

I had been aware of these posts in the last week, who couldn't be, but this evening they infuriated me for pushing my niece off the front page. My apologies if I offended anyone. It wasn't my intention. Neither did I intend to criticize any particular mod or member of the site admin.

21st Sep 2009, 19:32

Viv says:

I think one thing is quite clear that we have to find a way to stop this

21st Sep 2009, 19:50

This is definitely a troll. The trouble is it makes no difference if you feed this or not.

I think this is probably a bot of some kind. Perhaps this kind of thing would be avoided if you had a version of copy these letters in order to post. That way you could ensure there is a human sitting there for hours posting rubbish time and time again.

21st Sep 2009, 20:00

Spiderbaby says:

Has anyone tried a 'quiet word' in his ear? It is possible he might not realize how much of a problem he is being...

21st Sep 2009, 20:07

Kostika says:

We have to make sure that whatever is done is fair. No matter how annoying, currently the guy hasn't broken any rules of the site.

I would hope that no one leaves over this as we are working to find a fair solution. Trust me, this has been a very hot conversation piece.

21st Sep 2009, 20:18

Caine says:

JC, I meant no offense and I certainly didn't mean to be unfair. Apologies.

21st Sep 2009, 20:24

Sometimes I feal guilty when as an individual with a lot of people who work for me I occasionally just put my foot down and say to hell with what your opinions are I am right and the boss and this is whats is going to happen....

Ans sometimes doing that is the right thing to do..

Hanging around making sure we dont hurt some "Trolls" opinions just gives the annoying Oik extra time to Exist at the cost of my leasure and relaxation time when I might get the chance to browse the front page of Moblog.

Delte his posts , find his computer and jump up and down on it please....

If he gets upset afterwards send him my way and I promise to cuddle and stroke him

21st Sep 2009, 20:26

bronxelf says:

Spiderbaby- you are such an optimist...

21st Sep 2009, 20:43

paintist says:

is it just me...or are there other people who are posting images that are just not getting on to the page at all now?

21st Sep 2009, 21:11

bronxelf says:

It isn't just you. I sent a photo of rupert about 10 minutes ago that still hasn't gone up.

21st Sep 2009, 21:20

Craft says:

Divine intervention? : D

21st Sep 2009, 21:21

rhys says:

I posted too. Nothing as of yet.

21st Sep 2009, 21:22

paintist says:

ok so does the fact that it is some sort of malware(?) make it spam yet?

21st Sep 2009, 21:27

bronxelf says:

Unfortunately correlation !=causation.

We don't know what's causing the backlog.

(goodness knows I wish we COULD point to that...)

21st Sep 2009, 21:28

paintist says:

drat! I thought we had him....

21st Sep 2009, 21:29

rhys says:

P: If only...

21st Sep 2009, 21:34

Spiderbaby says:

Oh no, I'm not that optimistic here, just think that if the polite approach doesn't work then that provides ample justification for more stringent direct measures. Lack of response would also be indicative of a machine behind it all, making any plug-pulling decisions easier.

21st Sep 2009, 21:53

cariadus says:

I really can't see what the problem is here. For goodness sake delete the blog and let everyone get on with normal moblogging.

If he hasn't broken any rules then the rules need amending - fast. How about a limit of 10 posts per day for members and 20 posts per day for subscribers?

But as mods surely you have to ask yourselves if one person leaves Moblog because of this then it is damaging to the site and has to be stopped ASAP, rules or no rules.

21st Sep 2009, 22:19

paintist says:

I sent him the spam spam spam monty python link through contact user....he has just emailed me without going through moblog....he wants me to 'clarify' !!!!

21st Sep 2009, 22:21

Kostika says:

We're working on sorting out the problem posting. We don't know what's causing it atm.

21st Sep 2009, 22:23

paintist says:

I am not computer literate...but how did he get my personal email address???

21st Sep 2009, 22:26

Kostika says:

He will have replied to the contact email.

21st Sep 2009, 22:28

Caine says:

I just posted myself - the email post I sent has not shown up; I posted direct and that did show up.

As for FundyGuy, he doesn't care, he has no intention of interaction, all that matters is spewing his screed all over. Right now, he has 8 posts on the latest page; 6 posts on the 2 page of latest; 7 posts on the 3rd page of latest; 9 posts on the 4th page of latest; 8 posts on the 5th page of latest; 8 posts on the 6th page of latest and it goes on and on and on.

He's not just eating up one page - it's endless.

21st Sep 2009, 22:28

Helen says:

Paintist, when you contact a user through the site it goes through as a message from your email address. That's why your email address is required on the contact form thingy.

I guess that's to stop people sending you mail anonymously.

21st Sep 2009, 22:30

paintist says:

OK Helen, thank you....

so sorry this has gone on so long Twiglet...

21st Sep 2009, 22:33

Helen says:

Poor Twiglet's inbox.

Although serves her right for posting such a provocative photo!

21st Sep 2009, 22:38

Twiglet says:

Don't apologise, it's not like you're keeping me up.

To be honest I probably won't leave (sorry to those who don't like me, and you know who you are!) although this has annoyed much more than the sites recent high profile technical difficulties.

Thanks for the discussion and thanks also for the private emails. Much appreciated.

Helen: The choice of pic was deliberate. M/M always gets noticed.

21st Sep 2009, 22:42

harimanjaro says:

I think he's trying post the whole bloody bible one verse at a time.

21st Sep 2009, 22:45

Helen says:

There's an awful lot of brooding going on in it.

(I can almost smell 'em.)

Very apt.


21st Sep 2009, 22:46

Rich says:

Weather the storm, guys. Dunkirk spirit and all.

Just think "what would Ianto do?"

(obviously the answer "die of an alien virus" isn't strictly helpful in this circumstance but I'm sure you can think of more pertinent ideas.)

21st Sep 2009, 22:48

Craft says:

Ianto would get shagged good and proper by the Capt... OoooH Yeeaahhh..

21st Sep 2009, 22:49

Rich says:

Yes, why don't you all go and read some slash fiction, maybe a little flick of the bean, put it all into perspective. Praise Jesus!

21st Sep 2009, 22:52

Spiderbaby says:

That's the best advice I've heard all day :)

21st Sep 2009, 23:15

Rich says:

Come suckle from my fount of eternal verities.

21st Sep 2009, 23:22

ookiine says:

It's annoying as fucking piss! And now I can't send any pics in or there's a BIG delay from Gmail. Either way, it's pissing me off.

21st Sep 2009, 23:26

Spiderbaby says:

OK Rich, that hasn't worked. It's time to pull the plug, that is all. Nice try though.

21st Sep 2009, 23:42

Caine says:

And as we all speak here, FundyGuy has *increased* his posting. Now that he knows he's annoying the hell out of people, he's upped it. He'll view that as a victory; doing good for god.

22nd Sep 2009, 00:03

billion says:

hmph. good luck mods, hope it all comes together in the discussion room. I'm taking a wee moblog holiday 'til the mess gets sorted out.

22nd Sep 2009, 00:06

bronxelf says:

I'm not sure he's upped it on purpose. I think he may be autoposting.

On the other mitten, you could be right so he could therefore cry "persecution!" later.

22nd Sep 2009, 00:19

jc1000000 says:

Matt's just SORTED it.

22nd Sep 2009, 00:21

Caine says:

I bothered to keep count for a while tonight. After several people left some comments, his posts came in faster than usual. Either way, *sigh*

22nd Sep 2009, 00:21

billion says:

holy FUCK what happened there? cancel that flight! I'm coming home!!

22nd Sep 2009, 00:22

540air says:

From jc's "Spam of God" post.... (mod [jc] edit: linked up the post in case ppl want to follow)


mat says:

Right. It's not spam. Not by the definition in our terms and conditions. And that's the only definition that matter here.

I have hidden his account. Nobody has to look at his posts again. I *really* didn't like doing that without giving him a chance to do it himself, but hey. That OK with everyone?
22nd Sep 2009, 00:22 | edit | delete

22nd Sep 2009, 00:25

mat says:

I have hidden his account. Nobody has to look at his posts again, unless he unhides it when I'm not looking. I really didn't like doing that without giving him a chance to do it himself, or at least letting him know people weren't happy - but there you go.

22nd Sep 2009, 00:27

mat says:

540 - I was just getting here. Had an email or two show up in the meantime. :)

22nd Sep 2009, 00:27

540air says:

Sorry mat, not often I manage to react faster than you :)

22nd Sep 2009, 00:30

cariadus says:

Hooray!!

22nd Sep 2009, 00:31

Spiderbaby says:

Thank you mat.

22nd Sep 2009, 00:31

Caine says:

Hallelujah! And a most serious thank you. It's good to see photos on the latest page again.

22nd Sep 2009, 00:41

cariadus says:

Amen :)

22nd Sep 2009, 00:42

Rich says:

This means we're all going to hell, of course

22nd Sep 2009, 00:47

bronxelf says:

AF- Leave them be. I laughed good and hard at those during the conference call. :)

22nd Sep 2009, 00:54

bronxelf says:

I brought it to the attention to the whole call. :D

22nd Sep 2009, 01:00

jc1000000 says:

Yup, cracked me up too. It was 'a moment'.

22nd Sep 2009, 01:23

Twiglet says:

'Morning! I didn't miss anything did I?

22nd Sep 2009, 06:18

paintist says:

hahaha...look what you did :-)

22nd Sep 2009, 06:35

Twiglet says:

No I can't take credit for anything here. I think it was something a lot of people felt strongly about though. I'm sorry mat ended up doing something he wasn't happy about doing.

Thanks mat and mod/admin team.

22nd Sep 2009, 06:47

paintist says:

agreed, but you did give us the space to say what we thought, and not get hidden in the forum, where hardly anyone ever visits......
and yes mat and team should be thanked for dealing with it .. THANK YOU ALL ! :-)

22nd Sep 2009, 06:53

JokerXL says:

Well! What a read!

I have not actually seen any of his guff at all, been away a while, but it sounds horrendous.
Well done all for getting "people-power" mobilised and shutting the tit down, albeit temporarily I fear.

Now, as to multi-posts and the question of offensive spam; there have been a huge number of legs clogging-up the "latest" pages recently and I think it should be stopped. a limit of one leg per day for users and a pair for subscribers should surely be sufficient.
;-)

22nd Sep 2009, 07:38

cariadus says:

Can we reactivate his account so we can get the "don't do it or you'll go blind post". :)

22nd Sep 2009, 08:21

Puddlepuff says:

So frikking what? Can I start complaining when people upload bad quality pictures that make my eye's hurt?

22nd Sep 2009, 08:33

Twiglet says:

Presumably like everyone else you're at liberty to complain about anything you like.

Please be mindful that I have taken the greatest care not to cause offence.

22nd Sep 2009, 08:43

Puddlepuff says:

Hmmm could we block all cat pictures? Front page is overloaded with them!

22nd Sep 2009, 09:02

billion says:

only those who worship cats should be banned.

(sorry, couldn't resist...)

22nd Sep 2009, 11:22

beth says:

puddle > I tried this already. It backfired ferociously, the place became riddled with felines.

22nd Sep 2009, 17:00